Punchbowl: The Dungeoncast

Welcome to the Punchbowl, an interview segment about playing Dungeons and Dragons in 2017 and beyond. We talk to people who are pushing the game forward - creatively, communally, socially, just doing good work. Today, we sit down with Will and Brian, the hosts of the Dungeoncast, a podcast that breaks down every aspect of D&D one episode at a time. Find them on Twitter @thedungeoncast

The party continues on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, and Tumblr @JointhePartyPod! On our Patreon page (patreon.com/jointhepartypod), you can unlock exclusive bonus content like cut scenes, bloopers, character backstories, player blog posts, Dungeons & Dragons game tips, and so much more. Have stories or questions for the next Afterparty? Email hello@jointhepartypod.com or visit http://jointhepartypod.com/contact.  

This episode of Join the Party is produced and edited by Eric Silver. Mixed by Brandon Grugle.


TRANSCRIPT


ERIC: Hello, this is Eric, your DM, and welcome to the Punchbowl, our new interview segment on Join the Party. Even on our off weeks, I’m thinking about D&D, by playing it and coming up with random new characters that I’m never going to be able to use. But I also think about what it’s like playing a nearly 50-year-old game in 2017 and beyond. So I figured that I’d put that to good use and talk to to people who are pushing D&D forward - creatively, communally, socially, just doing good work. It’s like I ran into them at a party and I know them from Twitter but not actually in real life, so I want to just get them a drink and talk about everything they’re doing.
 
SP for our first segment, I called up two guys who host a show that I’ve been listening to since the begin. They are the Dungeoncast, a podcast that dives into all things D&D one episode at a time. They’re casual and educational without ever being condescending, even when working through the most basic of topics. Empathetic education is kind of radical, not only in the D&D space, but in nerd culture in general. It’s like if the Player’s Guide became a person you actually liked and just walked you through every single thing. I had to pick their brains on what they’re doing, why they’re doing it, and how it’s all coming together. We have Will, who will be speaking first, and Brian, who talks second. 
 
ERIC: What’s up, guys?
 
[00:01:24] WILL: Hey how's it going. We're doing good over here. 
 
[00:01:26] ERIC: That's great. Listeners at home, you can't see the really cool stuff that I'm looking at but I can see just like two D&D modules right behind me. I can't see which ones but, oh, is that SCAG on the left? 
 
WILL: Yeah that's SCAG and Out of the Abyss. 
 
ERIC: That’s awesome. First I just want to start off with your backgrounds. What is your experience playing Dungeons and Dragons?
 
[00:01:45] WILL: So I'm the longtime player of the two of us. I've been playing for almost eight years now. I started in fourth edition. I started as a player but it wasn't too long till like I became the de facto DM in pretty much everything I did. And once five came out I jumped ship and haven't looked back, although I do still love 4e. I know that's blasphemous to say in a lot of circles but I just love D&D.
 
[00:02:09] ERIC: I just want you to know this is safe space and you can talk about whatever it is you want. 
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:02:14] BRIAN: I appreciate it, very much appreciate it. I'm actually, I've been playing D&D for like a year now. 
 
WILL: I think a little bit more now.
 
BRIAN: A little more than a year now, wow. I’ve come a long way.
 
WILL: I force, I force everybody I meet to play the game. 
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:02:26] WILL: I haven't met somebody who didn't like the game. 
 
[00:02:30] BRIAN: It sounded right up my alley. I was into a ton of nerdy shit and I was just like--oh, is cursing okay? I'm sorry about that. 
 
ERIC: My producers are telling me that cursing is fine. 
 
WILL: Thank god!
 
[00:02:41] BRIAN: Sorry about that. It's been a while now, so a little over a year, and I've been DMing for like 4 months of it. So yeah, I'm relatively inexperienced, and that's kind of how our podcast kind of plays a little bit: like I'm, I'm the ride-along character for the inexperienced people. 
 
[00:02:55] ERIC: I think that actually ties into the first thing that I want to know about you two. Will, what is it like pulling new people into D&D? Do you have to like pick specific people you need for D&D, or like you have a strategy to just get everybody in?
 
[00:03:10] WILL: I am always looking to play a new game and my girlfriend likes to make fun of me because like she, she says I basically just infect everyone around me with D&D. And she doesn't understand how I get everybody I know to play, but I just I do! I bring it up, I talk about it a lot. I think people will get interested when you're really passionate about something. So you say, “Hey, do you want to give a shot? I'm running a game on such and such day,” and you'd be surprised, more people say yes than no. And again, I haven't had a friend or coworker or family member who tried to play the game and didn't end up loving it. 
 
ERIC: It’s just like, it's game tales that really hooks them?
 
WILL: Yeah, I think that's a big part of it. I tell a lot of stories, kind of like, “Oh, this one time a barbarian jumped off a waterfall, and I thought it was going to die, but I didn't, and I crit!” People like those stories. And it sounds exciting to them so they want to give it a shot. 
 
[00:03:56] ERIC: And then Brian, how did you feel getting seduced into playing D&D?
 
[00:03:58] BRIAN: Well I gave it, I gave it a shot, because there's some stigma to it that you’re playing pretend--but I love pretend! I'm not going to be ashamed about it, and I'm just gonna be myself, or in this case be the character that I set up, and once I jumped into roleplaying I found that, like, I really, I really have like a creative knack for this thing. It’s really up my alley. I love to do it, I love to pretend to be this fantastic person that I get to make up and add all these stats to. So, doing it for the first time, it took a little bit to get my bearings but once I did and got comfortable it was I could tell it’s just for me.
 
WILL: Yeah, I remember, actually after I got you and then our buddy Jake and Nick to play, it was like two sessions in, and you were like, I think this is it! Like, this is what I want to do!
 
[00:04:54] BRIAN: Yeah I know, right? This game is awesome! This is my new thing for sure. And now I'm doing a podcast about it. 
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:05:00] ERIC: So there are tons of 5E real play podcasts out there. Ours included, of course--just following the crowd there!
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:05:09] ERIC: But what made you want to do something different? I mean, you're doing this meta D&D campaign that literally starts from the ground up. Why this podcast?
 
[00:05:20] WILL: I think mostly because I do this anyway! Like, I'm constantly explaining D&D stuff to people who will listen to me all the time. And I think, well, Brian, there was a time where we worked together and while we were working I would just like tell them about stuff. And like our conversations were--to me they seemed interesting and funny, so we figured we’d record them.
 
[00:05:41] BRIAN: We would work together at an apartment complex at night, just the two of us. We were kind of night guards.
 
(Laughter)
 
BRIAN: And Will would just put the D&D on me every single night.
 
WILL: I’m sorry!
 
BRIAN: And I was like, actually, this sounds pretty cool. It sounds like something I want to do. And then I started getting into the conversation also. And then it came up where, you know, we spent all these nights together, we learned a lot about each other, I was like, well, I went to audio school and I have a lot of equipment. 
 
WILL: Oh yeah.
 
BRIAN: And Will was like, “Oh, I've always wanted to do a podcast!” And I was like, “I would love to do a podcast! What do we do it about?” It's like, “Why don't we do it about when we talk about all the time which is D&D?” 
 
[00:06:18] ERIC: I'm really sorry for that apartment complex. They were super not safe because you guys were talking about D&D instead.
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:06:23] WILL: Oh, yeah. 

ERIC: I'm sorry, you both looked at each other like I was your boss for a second, like, “Oh no!”
 
(Laughter) 
 
ERIC: It’s like, “Oh, this is all been a setup. This is the apartment complex police! 
 
WILL: I know, right?
 
ERIC: “We’re going to throw you in apartment complex jail.” 
 
BRIAN: Done for. 
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:06:42] WILL: Okay, so for me personally, just on my end two reasons number one there's a lot of actual plays out there. That's a lot of competition. And I am constantly on the lookout for one that I like, and you know, I got to say, most of them I'm not a huge fan of for whatever reason. So I didn't think that I had the capabilities of DMing something that would be interesting enough to hold people's attention. But I also felt like I had a lot to say about the subject and I had a lot of opinions on D&D that I don't see repeated in a lot of places, so I just kind of wanted to share my views and my experiences. And again, I was kind of just doing it anyway, so why not give it a shot?
 
[00:07:25] BRIAN: Yeah, when Will pitched that to me it was, “Hey, these, these kind of shoptalk conversations, they are a little bit unique to where you would go look for it on the Internet. It's kind of a little more difficult to find, I feel. So, yeah, let's let's bring something unique to the podcast game that isn't so available. 
 
[00:07:43] WILL: Yeah you don't see too many. As a matter of fact I don't really know any other podcasts that are, like, just kind of talking about the game. 
 
[00:07:50] ERIC: What are those opinions that you're worried about, or that aren’t out there?
 
[00:07:54] WILL: Um, I mean, I think on the podcast I guess I've gone into a couple of rants...
 
BRIAN: (Laughs)
 
WILL: Like, I had my rant on tieflings that I went on for a bit. You know, I think the biggest thing for me is elitists and gatekeepers of the game. I just can't stand that mentality, that there's a right way to play and a wrong way to play. And that, like... I don't like hearing about all the dungeon masters that are super, like, you know, “Fuck drow! I never allow drow at my table, that's disgusting! Blah blah blah, drow are always evil, there's no exception.” I just don't like that attitude because—
 
BRIAN: And that’s usually like a 4e to 5e thing. 
 
WILL: Yeah, there's a 4e to 5e issue too. Granted, I think 5e is a way better game than 4e, but 4e had some really cool stuff, and we can talk about that, and that's okay. And like, I just, there's a lot of haters in D&D and there's a lot of haters in not just D&D but across all nerd culture. I really don't care for most of it. 
 
[00:08:43] ERIC: I think accessibility for a lot of things around nerd culture are so dense that it really--not only is there like literally a guy standing in front of you being like, “Nah,” but like you know the entire back story there. And I think about what you guys are doing, you're kind of making that accessible. 
 
[00:08:59] WILL: Yeah, and that's actually, that's one of our goals. Because, you look at these books--and 5e is not as bad as previous editions--but you look at these books and they're really thick and daunting, you know, like, “Oh, I don't know if I want to get into this.” If you have someone just explaining it to you maybe it's a little easier. 
 
[00:09:13] BRIAN: Yeah, you see our episode title ‘tieflings.’ You’re like, oh shoot. I wanted to play it, but I didn't get into the reading. Maybe I could just pop this podcast in, it's like 30 minutes to an hour long, and just listen and get the information I need. And then when I go to look at it in the manual, yeah it is more accessible, it is an easier read. You can absorb the information better because you've heard it all. 
 
[00:09:34] ERIC: Is there something that you guys have covered lately that you think has kind of, like, gone above and beyond what you've read in the Players or the DM's Guide?
 
[00:09:42] BRIAN: Absolutely, yeah. 
 
[00:09:43] WILL: Oh yeah. Well, that’s kind of another premise for a show, is like, I talk about, well, here is what the game tells you. And here is in all my reading of fantasy literature, different examples or takes on this thing, like whether that be the Feywild or the Shadowfell or elves or whatever, like, I think one of the main things that we like to encourage is that like the game is more than the books. As a matter of fact, I would say the books only take up like X amount or percentage of the game. Like it's a it's a lot about homebrew. It's all about making the game your own.
 
[00:10:15] ERIC: I really like the parallels that you draw in between Dungeons and Dragons and Tolkien, Lord of the Rings. Especially like when you're talking about half orcs. It's like, no, this is what a D&D orc looks like. This is what a Twin Towers orc looks like the right guy.
 
BRIAN & WILL: Right. 
 
ERIC: So like making that bridge in between fantasy [properties] is very important. 
 
[00:10:36] WILL: Yeah, absolutely. And I grew up reading fantasy; as a matter of fact, I think I've said this on the podcast. But I grew up reading D&D books not even knowing they were D&D books. Like Dragonlance is a D&D setting. I can't tell you how many Dragonlance books I read as a kid I never even heard of do you till I was like in my mid-teens I had no idea I had already experienced D&D. I just didn’t know it. 
 
ERIC: That literally makes you the chosen one. 
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:11:00] ERIC: You didn’t even know it! You just rise up right out of nowhere and be like, “I have the power of a comprehensive D&D podcast!” So really, I think the prophecy has been foretold. 
 
WILL: That’s too funny. 
 
ERIC: Yeah. Yeah. Will, you can take that back to your friends, “Yeah, I was on a podcast, and like I filled the prophecy, and it's true. It’s chill. Whatever.”
 
WILL: Yeah, like, I'm the chosen one. Don’t worry. I got a handle on this. 
 
BRIAN: That’s too funny.
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:11:24] ERIC: You talk about these gatekeepers and people who are keeping others from having fun and from playing D&D. And I've also realized that, like, the gatekeepers usually don't know shit about shit.
 
(Laughter)
 
ERIC: Like, they just think that they know things. And obviously, being forgiving to newbies, what is something that people usually get wrong about D&D?
 
[00:11:46] BRIAN: Definitely the first thing that jumps out at me is like, “Oh, you're going to fantasy roleplay? that's childish.” I mean, we do that as children. But there's some mature topics going on, there's some real decision making going on in this fantasy roleplay. You can learn something about yourself, and like, who you really are and like what decisions you're going to stand in and make for this character. That seems very real to me every time I'm playing, like, oh man, this fantasy life that we're all participating in is in my hands right now. 
 
[00:12:18] WILL: I think for me when it comes to gatekeepers the main thing that I think irritates me is like those who tell you, like, that there's a right or wrong way to roleplay. And there really isn't. Like, oh you're a paladin, and you can't do that. Well, it's more complex than that. 
 
ERIC: Oh my god, I was just going to say about paladins. 
 
WILL: I think we talk about in the paladin episode how like they used to be back in previous editions, like rules you cannot break. Like you had to be lawful good. But now it's not so much like that, and I more encourage like creativity and character concept in role play scenario. And I don't like it when people just shut it down just because it doesn't sound right to them. I don't like, I wasn't a fan of how the horrible backlash when 4e came out the concept that tieflings and dragonborn in the Player’s Handbook. Like huge, huge like haters just coming out of the woodwork saying like, “This was atrocious and it shouldn't be allowed in,” like blah blah blah blah blah. It's like, dude, you don't have to use these races if you don't want to! But like they're here for a reason, and they're really cool, and god forbid Wizards [of the Coast] wants to try something different. You know what I mean? Like, you know, if you want to play an older edition go play that edition! Like no one's making you play 5e.
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:13:25] WILL: No one's making you play tiefling or have it at the table, but [if] you're going to get on other people about it, seems counter productive. Let them run their game the way they're going to run their game. You shouldn’t shame people for it. 
 
BRIAN: Yeah. 
 
[00:13:36] ERIC: You're really good at bringing newbies in. How have you been able to explain to people who aren't self-identified nerds what D&D is? I'm having a problem right now, well not even a problem, but I’m dealing with that trying to teach tell people about my podcast. I'm like, “It’s storytelling but like multiple people are doing it, and I'm the DM which means I like wrote a story but people are messing with it...” So how do you go about explaining to people what D&D is?
 
[00:14:02] BRIAN: I mean that's the hardest thing, isn't it. Like, heck, we've got a whole--our whole first episode is “What is D&D?” and it’s like an hour and 10 minutes long. 
 
WILL: Yeah, I mean I struggle with that too, I think. I take the same approach where I go, “Well, it's like collaborative storytelling” or like, I'll say, like, “Okay, you've seen Lord of the Rings, right? Well like imagine if you got to be those characters in Lord of the Rings and the story happened to you, but the person who controls that story was the Dungeon Master at your table and he told you, or he or she told you, what's going on. And you explore the world of Middle Earth, but like you know, it's not Middle Earth, it's your world, you do whatever you want.” Or I think I think the main thing I do is I will literally just tell stories from the game. And like even if the people I’m explaining to don't exactly understand how it works, they kind of get the idea. When I say like, “Oh, I was this barbarian named Steel Valthonis and like this thing I wanted fell off a waterfall, so because I'm a barbarian and I am not a coward, I dove off the waterfall. And my dungeon master had me role in athletics check and I succeeded and I got the item and I climbed back up the cliff,” and people hear that are like, oh dang, that sounds epic. And then they want to try it. And then once you get people to just try the game or listen to a game, then they understand. 
 
[00:15:12] BRIAN: Yeah, got to get your feet wet. 
 
[00:15:14] ERIC: I can confirm that that story is dope as hell and now I really want to play. 
 
(Laughter)
 
ERIC: I wanted to talk about character creation for a second. Where do you begin when you start rolling them up? I feel like I pick the race and then the background and then the class because I love it when the background informs your class and not the other way around. 
 
[00:15:33] WILL: Yeah, absolutely. 
 
BRIAN: That’s how I’ve always tried to build my characters as well. Like, I want to be... like, it's stereotypical, but if I want to be a fighter I'm going to have like a fighting background or whatever. If you're going to be a warlock you're going to [be], like, “Oh, my, my patron is going to influence the way I am as a character.” Like when we’re talking about taking warlock powers from Archfey, you might be touched with, you know, the kind of fey experience. Like, you're more whimsical, or...
 
WILL: You could be, yeah. Or more poetic, generally. 
 
BRIAN: Yes, yes.
 
WILL: Or more graceful than is normal, so yeah.
 
BRIAN: Like, basically, your personality takes on these, these personalities that a fey creature would have, so you're more, you're more that way. 
 
[00:16:17] ERIC: I think that it also kind of like breaks people out of the backgrounds that are suggested in the Player's Guide. It's like, if one more rogue becomes an urchin I'm going to like throw myself... 
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:16:26] WILL: Yeah, I know that, I feel you. I, I, the one thing that 5e really needs to come out with more of backgrounds I think. But also they do make it really easy to customize backgrounds, so just come up with your story and then build a background based off that. It's really simple. You just pick two skills, pick a couple tool proficiencies, and maybe re-skin one of the features of one of the other backgrounds, and bam, you've got your brand new, tasty, custom background.
 
BRIAN: (Approvingly) Tasty. 
 
[00:16:53] ERIC: Can you give me an example of one of these good, good homebrew backgrounds?
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:16:57] WILL: Okay, let's come up with one. So, we'll go with like, fey-touched? 
 
BRIAN: Yeah, yeah.
 
WILL: Maybe at some point you got lost in the fey and then you came back, and that's a big part of your background. So like, okay, so maybe you have proficiency in nature and in insight because your stay in the Fey made you have to deal with like dangers of nature and dangers of illusion. So you learn to be able to use nature to your advantage and be insightful in order to survive, and then maybe.... What's a tool proficiency that would be good in that scenario? 
 
[00:17:35] ERIC: Well there's one there's one that's subclassed from UA which is like the Ranger who can like find the portals in between the different worlds?
 
WILL: Oh, Horizon Walker, right?
 
ERIC: Yeah, yeah. So then you could take that and then move it—
 
WILL: Oh yeah, you're right! You could, because you had to find a way back. And now that you've done that you have a natural attunement to finding Fey Crossings and maybe Shadow Crossings. 
 
[00:17:57] ERIC: Exactly. And that’s your feature, like, scrying bones.
 
(Laughter)
 
WILL: There you go! Bam. Background done. 
 
[00:18:04] ERIC: I like it. All right, r/UA, I just want you to know we just made a new one and we’re going to post it...
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:18:07] BRIAN: There you go. Wizards, we got you. 
 
[00:18:13] ERIC: I want to hear more about your experiences as DMs, either as a DM or a player. Hit me with your game tails. 
 
[00:18:19] BRIAN: OK this is me as a player. I play an Air Genasi fighter in one of Will's games and he had us in a battle arena. So it was like, how many of us were there? Four, it’s like a four on four or four on five or something like that.
 
WILL: Something like that, yeah.
 
BRIAN: And instead of do a classic combat or we roll initiative, we were going to do something called the skill challenge where we basically work off of our skills list and you can't, the only rules are you can't really repeat the same skill twice. Like if you want to alternate between a few, if you want to alternate between athletics and, you know, anything else, you can do that. So there was a cool moment where I had a couple of guys, a couple of fighter guys, rushing me and I had to basically seek refuge. Will placed us in without any of our normal weapons, and we had to find weapons, Hunger Games-style, in the arena. 
 
WILL: (laughter)
 
[00:19:10] BRIAN: And I ended up picking up a bow, and my character had never used one before. So I find this, I don't find any arrows, I have to spend a turn like looking for weapons. And then I end up getting rushed. So I end up rushing up this, like, big mound of rocks, and I use my Mingle with the Wind to shoot myself up into a tree, so I basically just like jump up 30 feet into a tree. And, like, as I'm turning back I passed my check and I shot this guy right and in his, like, chest or leg or something, and took him down. So that was it. That was really cool. Really cool to do a combat that wasn't so standard, and really cool to have all this freedom to be like, “Yeah, I want to run up this rock cliff, and like kick off one of these rocks, and use my air push to lift me up into a tree, and as I'm doing that I'm gonna turn and shoot, and I nail this guy.
 
WILL: Yeah, it as more theatrical, and I enjoyed that. I remember running that, that was fun. Um, D&D stories. I know I have a billion of them, but the only one coming to mind is a really old story where I, once I played a halfling hex, played him in 4e, his name was Jack. He was a really whimsical and innocent kind of character. 
 
BRIAN: And there was also a wizard in the party. 
 
WILL: I don't remember the wizard's name but he was kind of an alcoholic jackass. 
 
(Laughter)
 
WILL: He was kind of a jerk. And I remember we were we were roaming through like fey-touched forest and we came into, like, this beautiful glen or whatnot. And of course there's a beautiful woman bathing in the pool. And as a player I know that this is like a trap. I know that this is a water nymph probably going to lure us in and kill us. But Jack didn't know that, and neither did the wizard. So the wizard tried to like woo this woman, like be charming or whatnot, and he filled his skill check really badly. And so I decided to have Jack give it a try and, like, he said something poetic, I don't remember what it was, and gave a bow and said something flattering. And I crit my persuasion check or whatever it was, my diplomacy, and the DM was having basically her react to my crit and the wizard couldn't stand for it. So he's, like, “I can't stand for this!” And he cast Prestidigitation on me making it appear as if I had completely soiled myself in a most embarrassing fashion...
 
[00:21:20] (Laughter)
 
WILL: ...at which point my, my poor halfling began to openly cry and run off into the forest. And it was at that point actually that the water nymph transformed and attacked the party and I wasn't there. So they were actually down their striker for like the first two rounds.
 
(Laughter)
 
WILL: But, yeah. D&D’s weird weird stuff.
 
ERIC: Listen, that comprises pretty much the majority of D&D stories, where it involves someone pooping themselves and embarrassing themselves in front of women. 
 
[00:21:58] (Laughter)
 
WILL: Absolutely.
 
[00:22:17] ERIC: That’s awesome. Is there something that you find a little bit too daunting to explain straightfoward? I think that you've all tackled the races, the classes, and the planes. Even the dragons, which, believe me, even as a DM, I am so happy that you explained. But is there something about D&D that you find just like a little bit too daunting to do on the podcast?
 
[00:22:24] WILL: I don't think so. 
 
BRIAN: No, there hasn’t been anything we've come across that we're like, “Nah.”
 
[00:22:25] ERIC: All right then, you know what? I think I’ll give you a challenge. I have three things about D&D that I'm very confused about, and I would really love it if you could explain it to me in like a sentence or two. 
 
[00:22:34] WILL: Okay, we’ll try. 
 
ERIC: All right. Please explain what a bonus action is. 
 
WILL: Oh God. 
 
(Laughter)
 
WILL: Okay, so a bonus action is... It's a ability that all players, regardless of class, have, but they only can use it if their class or background or race has a feature that can take advantage of it. 
 
[00:22:59] BRIAN: Yeah, there has to be something specific saying to take a bonus action. 
 
WILL: Yes.
 
ERIC: No, that was great! No, that was really helpful, thank you. Can you please pronounce the real name of mindflayers for me and explain to me what they are?
 
WILL: Their, their proper name is Illithid. And I've seen them portrayed in a lot of different ways. But basically what they are is, they are a parasitic race of, like, squid monsters that devour humanoid brains, but they also will take the place of, if they are requiring a humanoid body which most of them will at some point, they will devour the brain and replace it with their own, and take control of that humanoid body.
 
[00:23:44] ERIC: Nice, I like that. All right. Brian, help me out here. Explain to me who “that guy” is. You know, when people are talking about on the threads... 
 
(Laughter)
 
[00:24:25] BRIAN: Like, who is “that guy,” yeah.
 
ERIC: Yeah, who is that guy, that girl, that person. Explain to me who that is.
 
BRIAN: That guy is... “Oh yeah, so I set up my race and class so I can use this specific attack so I can max the damage out, and I'm going to be rolling six d10. And you better believe that it's going to be cold damage, and they're going to be frozen, and not going to be able to move.” Like, they're setting up their, they're setting up their meta-gaming, basically. You're going, oh, you're going to be that guy? You're just going to run this, you’re going to build something invincible and you're not going to care about the roleplay?
 
[00:24:27] ERIC: All right, one last question. I promise this is the last one. If you could change one way that people frame and talk about D&D, what would it be?
 
WILL: For me, honestly, some people, when I bring up D&D, they’ll be like, “Isn't that that game that like, that like people who, like, murder people play?” Like, there's like some 80s news story where some kid went on a murder spree and apparently he played D&D, and so people like have that stigma attached to it. I’m like, what? No! What?
 
[00:25:27] BRIAN: Mine would be, sometimes I'll tell people they have like this cool guy mentality like, “Oh, hey, yeah, I run and I host a podcast. It's about D&D!” and they kind of like look at me with side eye, like, “You run a D&D podcast? So you play D&D?” And I just feel like, oh man, this person's already lost. 
 
(Laughter)
 
BRIAN: I've lost the battle before I even, like, tried to begin to explain what this is. Like, they're so set, like, oh, you big nerd. And yes, it's nerdy! Like, why has that got to be bad?
 
[00:25:36] ERIC: All right. That is all I got left. How can people find you on the Internet?
 
WILL: Yeah, if you want to check us out we're the Dungeoncast. You can find us on soundcloud.com/Dungeoncast. We’re on iTunes, we’re pretty much on any podcast app or program out there. 
 
BRIAN: We’re YouTube if you search “the dungeoncast” you can get us there. That's pretty much it. 
 
WILL: Oh, and follow us on Twitter if you're interested in like taking polls on like what episodes we should do next or like entering our contest. We try and run like a contest like pretty much every few months where the prize will be some really dope like D&D related prize. 
 
[00:26:08] BRIAN: Yeah right now Will is running a contest for a Hero Forge Minis so if you tweet a link out to our show and #dungeoncast you are entered to win a mini. And so that drops on July 4th, right?
 
WILL: Yeah that will be on July 4th, so follow us on Twitter if you're interested in any of those things. 
 
ERIC: Thank you for talking to me, guys. This was great. 
 
[00:26:24] WILL: Yeah, I had a good time, thanks for having us! 
 
BRIAN: Yeah, it was good meeting you. Thank you very much for all your reaching out and everything, that's really been cool. 
 
WILL: Yeah we appreciate it. 
 
ERIC: Absolutely. 
 
(Theme music starts)
 
ERIC: Thank you for listening. If you enjoy this, please let us know. We want to do so many more of these in the future. Tell us who you want me to talk to, especially all those secret D&D players out there. I'm looking at you, Vin Diesel. Please come talk to me about Furious 8 and your barbarian dragon who lives one quarter mile at a time. Hit us up @JointhePartyPod on all of the social medias and email us at hello@jointhepartypod.com. The next chapter of The Wedding Party will be out next week. I'll see you then.